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Attn. Democrats! I Gotta Know…
Posted On:Feb 07, 2008
Being a voting American, I have of course done some homework on both of these candidates and their positions on major issues.
Being a conservative, I am kind of at a loss as to why anyone would vote for EITHER of them.
But being a curious sort, I confess to wondering why a voter would choose one over the other - and that’s where I need your help.
If you are a Hillary supporter, what specifically is her advantage over Obama in your eyes. And vice versa for Obama supporters.
Now mind you, I have no desire to know why I should vote for either of them over a conservative (assuming, that is, I were to find one.) So don’t bore me and other readers with anti-conservative blathering. This is your chance to explain in a clear, concise and logical manner why one of these two Democrat candidates is better than the other.
Now go for it!! ‘Cause I GOTTA know…
Back to the blog »


Posted by Jody Lee
Reader Reactions
Posted by ( jswintermute ) on February 07, 2008 at 8:46 pm
how about you answer first. If you are a Huckabee supporter, what specifically is his advantage over McCain in your eyes. And vice versa for McCain.
This is your chance to explain in a clear, concise and logical manner why one of these two Republican candidates is better than the other.
Now go for it!! ‘Cause I GOTTA know…
Posted by ( Jody Lee ) on February 07, 2008 at 11:43 pm
Tell you what. On MY blog, I’ll ask the questions, and on YOURS, you get to ask whatever you want. Silly you.
My attempt to start a debate between supporters of Democrat presidential hopefuls has, for some reason, touched a nerve (I thought it an innocent enough question), so since I am in a rare mood to appease, I will play along.
I currently support neither Huckabee nor McCain. I am undecided and frankly, uninspired by either choice.
How’s that for clear and concise?
Now, let’s get back to the question - why is Obama a better choice than Clinton, or why not?
Jody
Posted by ( Lori ) on February 08, 2008 at 8:52 am
When someone does their research on the candidates, and keeps an open mind, it is clear that each candidate has a plan for the problems and issues we currently face. Those with wisdom understand that there is no perfect candidate with one perfect solution because there is more than one right answer to solving the problems.
I am a “fence rider” in that I can see how each plan can help, and also not help. I can’t decide which issues are most important, because they all are. The economy, health care, and our military are the biggies for me. Clinton may “flip flop” on a solution to the war, but so have I, so I can relate to how she feels about our soldiers being killed to help save innocent victims.
Another thing to consider is whether our elected president can convince Congress to approve plans that will work. I believe we have some very educated, experienced candidates, all of them, and unfortunately, I am undecided as well. Sorry, that does not answer the question. I think some people can’t get over Bill Clinton, being the unethical human being that he was, and how it affected his presidency, and therefore can’t stand the thought of Hillary in office, being the forgiving wife that she was. And my daddy taught me that sometimes, no matter how nice you try to be, some people will just never like you. So, in my opinion, if you can get past the candidate who looks like a president, who is most appealing on camera, and dig deep into the issues that are important to you, you will figure out who to vote for. So will I!
Posted by ( Lewis Loflin ) on February 09, 2008 at 2:20 pm
I will begin this. First why is the left-wing or Obama for that matter not going after Hillery over NAFTA? Hillery claims all this “experience” yet her husband, allied with big business, followed a policy that has ruined the lives of millions of working Americans.
Again, why is not Obama’s personal ties to racist bigots like Wright and Farakhan not an issue?
Why does the issue of illegal immigration not even brought up at a Democratic debate? For that matter, the views of Clinton, Obama, and McCain are identical. All in an partnership of mega-corporations seeking cheap, exploitable labor are open borders and mass amnesty.
In fact except for Iraq and nothing issues like abortion, on most economic issues McCain, Hillery, and Obama are identical. The represent the elite that benefit from the present system.
Lori brought up a very valid question on congress. An all Republican Congress and President has reduced the Federal government to a wreck. In most cases it was with the help of Democrats.
An all Democratic President and Congress will be more of the same. The simple fact is the elites of both parties has no connection with or concern with the average person.
In other words there is no real choice other than who will do the least damage.
i don’t want “nice” people or don’t care about their race or gender. I want someone that will follow the Constitution as written and represent all people equally.
In this climate of bitter public division it would be best if government would stay out of most issues. Some are still bitter over the 2000 election and this growing literal hate between segments of our society will destroy us.
Posted by ( Jody Lee ) on February 09, 2008 at 9:23 pm
Lewis, if you will check out my blog entry titled “My Pastor, Myself”, you will find that Obama’s ties to his preacher ARE in question, at least by the public.
Here is my take on your observation - while Hillary and Obama will fight over their differences on the issues, I think each is holding back from going “personal” with their attacks for one reason - a possible joint ticket. If Hillary wins the nomination, her best bet will be Obama as a running mate - and he is young enough to be able to afford to cool his heels eight years if it means being a shoe-in for the nomination when Hil steps down (which it would). They can argue policy, but saying anything too controversial might nix the deal - once the words are out, they can’t be taken back and it could make running as a team difficult, if not impossible.
And by the by, if you truly want the government out of most issues, is it safe to assume you are a liberterian?
Jody Lee
Posted by ( chris ) on February 11, 2008 at 6:46 pm
What specific personal ties does Obama have with Farrahkan? Inuendo is a wonderful thing don’t you think?
Posted by ( Lewis Loflin ) on February 12, 2008 at 4:30 am
Hi Jody,
If you mean “libertarian” in the extreme sense of shutting down the government in everything such a public education, etc. no. But the intrusion into private matters and economic meddling is going out of control.
If one owns a restaurant, it’s up to them if their patrons smoke, who hey serve, etc. The only thing the government should be concerned with is safety, such as a sound building, proper fire exits, and proper electrical wiring, and sanitation. The rest is up to the business and their patrons.
I’d like to see a lot of things turned back to state/local control, an end to unfunded mandates, a total end to affirmative action, no child left behind, and all forms of social engineering.
Shut down this lawsuit industry. Litigation and insurance costs are killing us. Passing a few laws could stop this cold.
For example in education we have total equality, one academic standard, every child takes the same subjects, etc. and pass/fail is up to them. No special treatment, no race quotas, etc. Total color blind. Everything is done in English, no bilingual anything.
That’s what equal opportunity is about. Go to a flat tax system. Everyone pays the same percentage, no deductions other than direct say business cost. That would clean up a lot of corruption in itself.
All laws, enforce them equally or repeal them. Using illegal drugs is a crime, jail them. Being an illegal alien is a crime, deal with them and their illegal employers.
I’m sure someone will come back with some snide remark that illegal aliens don’t hurt working people. Here you go, a victory in Arizona. From the left-wing News York Times,
“Juan Leon, a construction subcontractor and the husband of Elizabeth Leon, the day care worker, said illegal immigrants had made it harder for legal residents like him to find work. Companies that employ them can bid much lower on projects than he can because they pay workers much less, Mr. Leon said.
�I hate to see families torn apart,� he said of the current flight, �but there is no money to be made sometimes because some contractors who employ illegal workers can do the job dirt cheap.�
The entire article is here: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/12/us/12arizona.html?_r=1&th;&emc;=th&oref=slogin
Simple law enforcement and they leave in droves and are saving Arizona taxpayers millions in the process.
I hope that gives you an idea. I don’t know if that is libertarian, old style liberal or what. I consider myself a classical pre-1960s liberal on most things.
We need reasonable government to maintain an orderly society and I accept funding a reasonable safety net to help the really destitute. But we don’t need government as an industry.
Posted by ( Lewis Loflin ) on February 12, 2008 at 4:48 am
Here is more info on Obama in relation to Farakhan, ect. To quote,
Obama counters insinuations that he is not a Muslim by claiming membership in this particular church. But when this church�s minister sponsors someone like Farakhan who is well known as a Black Muslim, I think it makes one wonder if Obama is being ingenuous. As I understand it just as in Judaism the child of a Jewish mother is Jewish, the child of a Muslim father is a Muslim. I have not heard of his conversion nor have I read of any Fatwah being issued against him which always occurs following a conversion. I think Obamo has a lot of explaining to do and should sever his ties with this particular church. We after all are judged by our companions One who aspires to the presidency of the United States can not be perceived to be a Black Muslim separatist nor one who sponsors antisemitism.
Full article: http://elections.jta.org/2008/01/15/richard-cohen-to-obama-present-wont-cut-it-on-farrakhan/
As Jody pointed out, Obama’s ties to racists is a fair issue. If McCain attended a KKK church, the liberals would be rioting in the streets. Why the double standard?
Posted by ( Lewis Loflin ) on February 14, 2008 at 5:40 am
I’m going to retract part of what I wrote:
“In fact except for Iraq and nothing issues like abortion, on most economic issues McCain, Hillery, and Obama are identical.”
This I just got from the Washington Post which to me is a plus for Obama. To quote,
“As a campaign issue, earmarks highlight significant differences in the spending philosophies of the top three candidates. Clinton
has repeatedly supported earmarks as a way to bring home money for projects, while Obama adheres to a policy of using them only to support public entities.”
I’m dead set against using public funds for private projects, most of which is pork-barrel waste. Boucher himself is the pork king of SW Virginia.
The full article is at:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/02/13/AR2008021303635.html?wpisrc=newsletter
Posted by ( captainkona ) on February 17, 2008 at 4:34 pm
Hi, Jodi.
Just stopped by to see if you were any wiser.
Nope, you’re still a f---ing idiot.
You remind me of Hillary Clinton. Spastic, prone to mood swings and in need of anger management. Two faced, a liar, self serving and consumed with ego.
You both look like an old leather boot too.
We support Obama over Hillary because Hillary is just like you.
I’d give you a nice post but you’ll probably plagiarize it like you did the last one.
Well, have a nice day.
NOTES FROM JODY: Just for the record, I cleaned up this guy’s “f” word. Wouldn’t want anyone to accuse me of unacknowledged editing.
In regards to the overall note, I posted this so that those of you who engage in intelligent debate can give yourselves a pat on the back for doing so. I give you one as well.
I wonder if he knows what “plagerize” means? If so, can anyone imagine why I would want to plagerize this fellow? Ever? Hm.
Oh, well. Such hate usually springs from a very sad place.
j
Posted by ( Pop ) on February 18, 2008 at 9:55 am
Jody, why even bother to waste good blog space and print the rambling, and most likely, drug induced garbage of this insignificant scum? If you check out his website, you can see where he’s coming from. I understand that you were only trying to prove a point, but don’t dirty your blog with his worthless nonsense. As you stated, he’s got to be a pretty sad and lonely individual. I appreciate what you do here and enjoy (most of) the debates.
Note from Jody: You have a good point. I simply wanted to show that I am truly willing to print all sides, even the idiotic ones. Since that time, I have decided that for the first time, I am going to block someone from participating. This blogger does indeed lower the level of the whole effort, so his voice will no longer be heard. His comments will not even be read by me before being deleted - the freely-given right to participate has been abused so that’s that.
I have not gone to his web site and will not, but it is not hard to imagine where he is coming from. Thanks for note. You are right - no more wasted space. Thanks “Pop”.
jl
Posted by ( chris ) on February 20, 2008 at 8:19 am
Ya know, I really try to understand and keep an open mind when discussing issue differences here. I will freely admit my own arrogance which has been deftly pointed out to me on occassion. I have tried to take that in stride and do better, maybe I have and maybe I haven’t. That being said, I cannot rid myself of the feeling that dealing with a poster who is without the ability to cognitively comprehend an argument and respond in kind, is much like reasoning with a crying drunk. I absolutely write this with all due respect but jeez!!!!
It is very simple. One poster SPECIFICALLY STATES: “Again, why is not Obama�s personal ties to racist bigots like Wright and Farakhan not an issue?
Another poster responds with:"What specific personal ties does Obama have with Farrahkan?” Now ladies and gentlemen; that is a simple question which directly asks for demonstrative examples to validate a profound statement. Such validation is not only necessary but a responsibility when one makes such assinine statements.
Here is what we get; a reference to drivel made by a conservative columnist based on nothing but opinion. Lewis chose to support his claim of personal ties between Obama and Farrahkan by giving us rhetoric of a op-ed columnist. He chose to give us a quote which shows nothing but racism in that Cohen seems to think that Obama has some king of responsibility to prove he is not a black muslim seperatist. Why? Well, because his father was a muslim and he attends a church in which the pastor says some contraversial things about being black in America. It is beyond me how a logical person can respond to a simple question asking for specifics by giving more inuendo.
Lewis, you must educate yourself on logical fallacies and strawman arguments. I really want to engage you in a cogent manner. But, you need to tell the truth. You cannot in no way link Obama to Farrakhan in a personal manner. You know, I know it, and for you to try to prove this crap by giving us opinion from Richard Cohen shows that your efforts are disingenious. I guess since you are big on imagining ties, then would it be wrong to assert that you are a racist because you utilize the drivel of the Cohen piece to make an argument? What a tool!!!!
(Note from Jody: Lewis, I have to applaud your use of the phrase “what a tool!” I haven’t heard that one in years and it’s a classic! What fun - jl)
Posted by ( Chris ) on February 22, 2008 at 11:46 am
Jody,
I assume you meant chris instead of Lewis in your indication of the use of the “what a tool” phrase. Anyway, thanks, and as I leave this soapbox I still am ripe with incredulous hope that Lewis will at least try to give me some verifiable evidence that Obama and Farrahkan have personal ties. Until then I will take the silence as an indication of him accepting reality.
Posted by ( matt ) on February 26, 2008 at 11:53 am
Regardless of whether Obama wants the endorsement from Farrakhan he gets it. In the 2004 election who came in at the midnight hour to encourage the American people to vote for Kerry?? Hint he’s 6’6 wears a turban and has tried to destroy the United States. Yes Mr. Bin Laden himself. What does it say about the Democratic party that these people endorse them? Oh well. In my opinion the Dems could win the election with Clinton but if Obama gets the nomination there will be almost 0% chance. Too many people (perhaps ignorantly) can’t overlook his racist and Muslim ties.
Posted by ( Chris ) on February 29, 2008 at 3:06 pm
Matt,
What about this don’t you guys understand? First of all it is totally irresponsible to throw out accusations without any verification. So I ask you, what specifically are Obama’s racist and Muslim ties? Your accusations are ridiculous and without merit. You should be ashamed. For the record I will expect you to no condemn John McCain for graciously accepting the endorsement of John Hagee, who has without a doubt shown his bigotry towards homosexuals and Catholics. I guess one must be ignorant to overlook McCain’s racist and bigoted ties.
As for your ridiculous claim that Bin Laden endorsed Kerry I must say that is right out of good ol’ oxylimbaugh’s playbook. Let us examine the facts here Matt (something you seemed to conviently forget to give) Here is exactly what Bin Laden said in that tape in 2004:
“Your security is not in the hands of Kerry or Bush or al Qaeda. Your security is in your own hands and _each state which does not harm our security will remain safe_.”
Your insinuation about this being a endorsement is nothing but a two bit hack job. You should be ashamed. The implication was clear. Bin Laden clearly hates Bush. So what?????? How is anything in that tape an endorsement for Kerry?? Grow up.
Posted by ( Miley More ) on April 17, 2008 at 2:31 pm
Great information, thank you for the knowledge
>
Posted by ( producator de incaltaminte ) on May 05, 2008 at 11:19 am
Your rather prefer McCain to win the elections? It’s okay to have a woman in the White House, but not any woman.
Posted by ( allison g ) on May 06, 2008 at 3:49 pm
In a nutshell, Hillary has left a bad taste in my mouth for the following reasons:
1) Making the initial cornerstone of her campaign her “experience” when, in my opinion, all her years as First Lady are not the type of experience that counts.
2) She has devolved into playing cheap politics, e.g., hammering away at Obama’s guns & religion comment...disagree with his comment all you want, but can we please talk about substantive issues instead of trying to drive wedges based on sound bites?
3) She has started on this new narrative that Barak Obama is an “elite” while she’s down to Earth, which is patently ridiculous. She’s the epitome of elite. Granted, Barak and his wife aren’t exactly hobos either
4) The gas tax holiday is blatant pandering that won’t lower the price of gas, and she knows it. Her jumping on this bandwagon supports the notion that she’ll do anything that’s politically expedient.
That said, Barak is not perfect either, but he hasn’t accumulated a long list of things that have turned me off during the campaign.
Posted by ( Drug Treatment ) on June 02, 2008 at 12:20 pm
I wonder if any candidate, once elected, will really keep their promise and get rid of all the garbage and junkies from the streets. There should be more free rehab clinics for those who really want to get clean and don’t have health insurance. If these people are looking to repent, they should have the means to do so.
Posted by ( timada ) on June 25, 2008 at 12:18 pm
When it comes about politics I loose myself in details. I posted this comment just to say, that in my opinion, is not about choosing one of these two Democrat candidates, is about choosing a human. You don’t really need to see if they are democrats, conservators or something else here is about choosing a human.
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Ada - Nouveau Riche